Search rightsnet
Search options

Where

Benefit

Jurisdiction

Jurisdiction

From

to

Forum Home  →  Discussion  →  Universal credit migration  →  Thread

New style ESA and a reverse lobster manoeuvre?

 < 1 2

Charles
forum member

Accountant, Haffner Hoff Ltd, Manchester

Send message

Total Posts: 473

Joined: 27 February 2019

Oh, I didn’t realise they weren’t on HB yet. I don’t think the RLM (!) can be done then.

Dan Manville
forum member

Mental health & welfare rights service - Wolverhampton City Council

Send message

Total Posts: 2249

Joined: 15 October 2012

Charles - 19 November 2019 01:51 PM

Oh, I didn’t realise they weren’t on HB yet. I don’t think the RLM (!) can be done then.

Why not? The NSESA converts back to CESA by virtue of art 6 of the Commencement Order if we withdraw the UC then request a supsersession which we have done. SDP on that then claim HB.

 

Charles
forum member

Accountant, Haffner Hoff Ltd, Manchester

Send message

Total Posts: 473

Joined: 27 February 2019

Art 6 only applies when a claim for UC cannot be made. At the moment, a claim for UC can be made, as no SDP is in payment.

Art 6 would be used, for example, in a case where a claimant moves to temporary accommodation, and starts receiving HB which includes an SDP. At that point the UC claim could be closed, and the NS-ESA converted to an old-style award including an income-related element.

[ Edited: 19 Nov 2019 at 02:47 pm by Charles ]
Dan Manville
forum member

Mental health & welfare rights service - Wolverhampton City Council

Send message

Total Posts: 2249

Joined: 15 October 2012

You had me worried there but I’ve sussed it.

art6(1)(e)(ii) permits the Sec State under reg 4 UC(TP) regs not to demand the UC claim. It’s at the Sec State’s discretion whether to accept a claim for legacy once UC is no longer in payment.

In my client’s case they have excercised that favourably and they are back on IRESA; we have achieved the Complete Reverse Lobster Manourvre (CRLM)!

This also explains how they have been putting people back onto legacy willy nilly; there was an escape hatch in the Lobster Pot all along…

Charles
forum member

Accountant, Haffner Hoff Ltd, Manchester

Send message

Total Posts: 473

Joined: 27 February 2019

This surprises me greatly. Technically, determinations under Reg 4 of the TP Regs can be made about claims made in a geographical area, or for categories of cases, but not simply for individual cases.
In the past, when a determination was made, it was subsequently published by DWP. This was done in two cases: the Grenfell Tower area, and when they stopped accepting new claims from live service areas.