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Forum Home  →  Discussion  →  Decision making and appeals  →  Thread

Considering DLA when looking at PIP appeal. 

AYoung
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Newcastle Council Welfare Rights Service

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Total Posts: 30

Joined: 6 June 2019

Hi, im looking for a little bit of clarity around a Tribunals powers if possible.

I am working with a client who was receiving High Rate DLA Care and Mobility and in 2018 was invited to apply for PIP. She did so but the award was refused. She appealed and sought advice from us when the appeal bundle arrived. We drafted her submission, submitted medical evidence etc, and the appeal was listed for April 2019. However a few days before the hearing we received a directions notice saying the hearing was postponed because the Tribunal were concerned that there was evidence in the bundle and medical records to say that she shouldn’t have had DLA for as long as she did.

hearing is now next week and has been scheduled for 3 SLOTS!!! Medical records have been obtained at the Tribunals request back to 2013.

The client was awarded DLA as a 15 year old (She is now mid 30’s) and it was awarded as a life time award. The client understands the rules of DLA and as far as she is concerned there has been no improvement in her care needs or her mobility and so she has never notified DLA.

My concern is that this is going to turn in to a DLA appeal rather than a PIP appeal. The DWP have been instructed to attend, and it almost feels as though the Tribunal want to find evidence to allow the DWP to investigate this clients DLA, rather than focus on her PIP.

S12(8)(b) Social Security Act 1998 states that Tribunals must not take in to account matters that were not obtaining to the date of the decision. Given that we are looking at a PIP decision from June 2018, what jurisdiction does the Tribunal have to go back beyond 2018 and consider DLA related issues?

Many thanks in advance for any information you can share.

John Birks
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Welfare Rights and Debt Advice - Stockport Council

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R(M)1/96 addressed the First-tier Tribunal’s duty to give reasons when there’s lesser entitlement to DLA than was previously awarded.

You will find more help here > https://pipinfo.net/issues/transitional-issues

Rules on withdrawal are here > https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/2685/article/17/made

Presume you have made something of the medical evidence?

No they can’t make a decision on the previous DLA award but can make a decision, I guess, that they were entitled to a higher award, but I doubt it.

If however, they think the claimant was not entitled before transfer then it may cast doubt on entitlement to PIP or at least their own evidence doesn’t count for much or something.

The tribunal can remit back to the DM.

In the end there’s a gulf between ‘need not’ and ‘shall not.’

(8)In deciding an appeal under this section, an appeal tribunal—
(a)need not consider any issue that is not raised by the appeal; and
(b)shall not take into account any circumstances not obtaining at the time when the decision appealed against was made.

“Section 12(8)(a) therefore does not limit the overall jurisdiction of an appeal tribunal, but grants it a discretion as to the extent to which it exercises this inquisitorial role. That discretion must be exercised judicially. An appeal tribunal is under a duty to consider whether or not to exercise the discretion where the circumstances could warrant it and would err in law by failing to do so or by failing to give adequate reasons for its conclusion.”

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ROBBO
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Welfare rights team - Stockport Advice

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Any excuse to reference the ‘elephants in the room’.

https://www.gov.uk/administrative-appeals-tribunal-decisions/dr-v-secretary-of-state-for-work-and-pensions-pip-2018-ukut-209-aac

The UT did not go back to the DLA decision - but a pointed suggestion to the Secretary of State that it might be a good idea…

“33 Is there a second elephant in the room? The appellant was previously entitled
to DLA at the lowest rate of the care component and the higher rate of the mobility
component (section A of the Secretary of State’s Submission). On the basis of the
evidence disclosed at the hearing, the Secretary of State may wish to revisit entitlement
to DLA and, indeed, any other benefit he received which was based on disability or
incapacity for work.”

AYoung
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Newcastle Council Welfare Rights Service

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Joined: 6 June 2019

Thanks for that. That’s really helpful. It almost feels as though the Tribunal have already decided on PIP and are using this as a way of obtaining information to help the DWP review past DLA entitlement.

will have to see what Wednesday brings.