Does the recovery for a fine from UC always have to be the maximum 40% of standard allowance?

It looks as if, reading the Fines Regs along with the UC (D&A) Regs, it’s only the decision as to whether a deduction can be made at all that can be appealed ( Sched 3, para 10, UC (D&A) Regs) decision whether benefit is sufficient for a deduction to be made.

When it comes to the maximum though, I think the regs are pretty clear about the 2 parameters and that any amount inbetween those can be deducted. So to ALWAYS apply the maximum looks like the use of a blanket rule instead of exercising discretion.

The way the full service guidance on 3rd party deductions reads it could be interpreted as saying it’s the maximum unless reduced pound for pound as described. But I don’t think the regs support that reading - in other words, I think they do have the power to deduct less, at any level between the 2 parameters, as in the Fines Regs, reg 4 (1B). I wonder if this is like rent arrears (where in some areas of the country they seem never to go below the maximum, & elsewhere they do reduce it), or whether they really are simply applying the maximum everywhere unless the guidance below applies?

Fines

Fines will have a maximum and minimum deduction rate. The maximum amount will be £108.35 per month (equivalent to £25 per week). 


The minimum deduction rate will be an amount equivalent to 5% of the benefit unit’s Universal Credit Standard Allowance. If there is insufficient Universal Credit in payment to take the full 5%, nothing will be deducted.

The maximum amount of £108.35 will be reduced pound for pound by any other deductions being made from Universal Credit. This is because the amount deducted for fines must not go above the overall maximum deduction rate of 40% of the benefit unit’s Universal Credit Standard Allowance. This includes any fraud penalties or conditionality sanctions that are being applied, or any advances that are being recovered.

Thanks for that. I wonder where we go next with this? Leave it to individuals to challenge?  Do you know if CPAG are calling for cases so they can challenge the max amount being deducted by way of Judicial Review?

Any other thoughts?

I attach my summary of the situation

Agree that the DWP interpretation is that in the case of a fine, hardship would not be a reason to reduce below the maximum deduction and that the deduction would only be lower than the maximum in the case of other deductions which take a higher priority than the fine which effectively mean the fine gets a smaller share of the overall maximum deduction.

Thanks Sarah. Yes, and that was also their intention from the Explanatory Memorandum etc (as in my summary I attached above). Question is, what next?

JR?

See if PLP are interested:
http://www.publiclawproject.org.uk/current-priorities

CPAG (not as far as I know specifically looking for cases like this but you could try):
http://www.cpag.org.uk/test-case-referrals

I would also try complaining and make the point that UC is supposed to help people manage their own finances. The 3rd party deduction system seems to do exactly the opposite of that, & causes poverty & deprivation.

Involve client’s MP?

I’ve just come across a client in this situation - we are going to apply for deductions for the arrears at 20% simply because the fine is being taken at the full 40% and on top of that a social fund loan is being taken at £26 p/m.

Hoping that his overall monthly payment is not reduced below the £183 he currently gets….

Let us know how you get on.

I’m wondering if anyone has had any success with this

Hello again
Has anyone had any joy with this?
Thanks
Clive

So there’s this Rightsnet news item of a parliamentary answer by Minister for Employment Alok Sharma on this:

https://www.rightsnet.org.uk/welfare-rights/news/item/6-per-cent-of-full-service-universal-credit-awards-had-deductions-of-40-per

ending with:
“NB - Mr Sharma added that claimants in financial difficulty as a result of the level of deductions can contact the DWP to request a reduction.”

So far then, this is all I can suggest advisers use to request a reduction! 

I’m tempted to say, “You couldn’t make it up! Well some do!” but I won’t.