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Carer made to attend Job Centre on weekly basis
Reposting as it might be lost on other thread -
Have a customer who after his wife was awarded PIP., claimed Carer’s Allowance and we advised to claim Income Support rather than claim through ESA. Had to attend JCP., asked how many hours he cared for his wife, he said it varied but certainly met the 35 hours required. Was advised they would put it down as every morning and he would have to consider looking for a job for the free afternoons he has. Is being asked to attend JCP every week. Has now been awarded PIP himself, JCP have suggested he claims ESA but they are better of claiming via IS. His wife is now in the process of claiming Carer’s Allowance…..we await what happens next. Was told that ‘they’ are clamping down on carers.
Is it the frequency of the WFI’s or the WFI themselves being objected to?
If it’s the frequency - My understanding so far - is that you can ask for a reconsideration of the Action Plan.
For instance - if the afternoons are taken up by caring rather than being free then this needs to be explained.
‘Clamping down on Carers’ is a reference to the new regulations with flexible WFI’s.
‘Clamping down on Carers’ is a reference to the new regulations with flexible WFI’s.
Which don’t affect carers.
You will note, if you read the regulations, the following;
Requirement to undertake work-related activity
2.
—(1) The Secretary of State may require a person who satisfies the requirements in paragraph (2) to undertake work-related activity(a) as a condition of continuing to be entitled to the full amount of income support payable apart from these Regulations.
(2)
The requirements referred to in paragraph (1) are that the person—
(a)
is entitled to income support;
(b)
is not a lone parent(b) of a child under the age of 3; and
(c)
falls only within paragraph 1(1) of Schedule 1B to the Income Support (General) Regulations 1987 and no other paragraph within that Schedule.
Schedule IB sets out ‘prescribed categories of person’ - i.e. those who can claim IS. Para 1(1) of that schedule deals with ‘Lone Parents’. - i.e. the regs apply only to lone parents and only then where the child is over the age of 3. The claimant in this case is not a lone parent and in any event falls under para. 4 of the Schedule IB - ‘Persons caring for another person.’ Which means that even if they were a lone parent of a child aged 4, the regs still would not apply.
I have had this myself and forced the numpty up at the local jobcentre to back down - they just don’t understand the provisions. Probably as a result of some idiot piece of internal guidance that’s gone out….
As you’ve pointed out WRA doesn’t apply.
The new regs are WRA not WFI’s. The poor worker at the DWP probably spends all day doing the same thing and may have made a mistake.
I’m not convinced that a WFI is not required, however.
It depends on what the client wants and happened at the WFI - does he want to attend WFIs? That’s not clear from the post. Or is it the frequency?
Weekly seems a bit much but if there’s a plan been made and agreed (whether that was understood at the time by the claimant or not) then you ask for it to be renegotiated.
Or you can kick off, shout, call names, write to the MP first…....
I know which way I’d prefer….
reg 4 of the Jobcentre Plus Interview regs states that WFI’s for carers only happen at certain trigger points; weekly WFIs for carers is a nonsense and if it were to keep happening I would be assisting the person for whom one of the carers was caring for to seek advice about a poss discrim claim as it’s edging on indirect discrim.
There’s no doubt that WFIs can be required. But certainly no WRA or making themselves available for and looking for work. I would complain if weekly WFIs were imposed when there is no requirement for the claimant to do anything more than the WFI. A weekly imposition would be a) a waste of JC+ resources b) a waste of the claimant’s time c) vindictive d) harassment.
I would get medieval on their ass.
“Was advised…………….. he would have to consider looking for a job for the free afternoons he has”.
In what universe does the DWP think that someone not on JSA/UC has to be looking for work?
“Was told that ‘they’ are clamping down on carers”.
Extraordinary language and wholly inappropriate. To think of or to talk in such a fashion of a group of people who care for severely sick or disabled peopl,e for less than £2 an hour thus saving the state a small fortune, as a group that needs to be “clamped down on” is insensitive and appalling and any civil servant who does so should be disciplined and severely reprimanded.
Best take away the earnings rule on not being ‘gainfully employed’ then and make sure no carer works…..
Many carers do and have to work. Not all carers are eligible for CA.
If I was to be personally affronted it would be that 35hr Caring = £62.10 (max) whereas 15hrs work = £97.50(min.)
In the present reality the claimant can only have given the info to say they were free in the afternoon. Or maybe it was tricked out of them. Either way why not give them the info and advice to earn some money?
Then again whose to say the adviser isn’t a Carer and has caring responsibilities?
Then again if someone was providing physically demanding care 35hrs+ a week then maybe working in the PM would be beyond reason.
The current ??Zeitgeist?? is about work and why would it be reasonable for the WFI not to mention W when that’s the subject of the FI?
The rest is semantics - did the adviser say this or mean that? Typically, as we’re human, there’s always a bit of VAT added to everything from all sides.
Except for me last Friday.
We had already decided to attend with the customer at the next appointment he has at JCP. We have had the experience of an initial WFI at the start of a claim with other customers and then no more contact but in this case the conversation did go into the ‘free’ time he would have from his caring responsibilities even though being away from his wife increased her level of anxiety. Then imposed the requirement to attend weekly. Interesting the JCP response to the claimant himself being awarded PIP., that he should claim ESA., but he would be worse off if he did. Obviously would be good to keep this couple with the income maximised as it will be frozen as UC come in. Will update you, but many thanks for your replies.
[ Edited: 20 Feb 2015 at 12:54 pm by FIT Advisor ]“I would get medieval on their ass.”
Ooh, “Fifty Shades of JSA” 😊
You may already have considered this, but would he get a severe disability premium if he wife didn’t claim CA?
I wondered about the possibility of double SDPs instead of double carer premiums - are the right rates of PIP awarded for this to be an option?
Interesting points made here. I’ll keep an eye on this.
Would he not be expected to claim as a carer to get Income Support? Will check the situation regarding his wife opting not to claim Carer’s Allowance.
Checked re wife not claiming CA. Daughter has recently left home so the conditions for a single SDP can be met. Carers Allowance claim is to be backdated to June linked to the delay in PIP being awarded to husband. As she gives up CA., for 8 weeks the Carer Premium should still be paid alongside the SDP. Will keep you posted on the situation with JCP and demands made in respect of conditionality for husband’s IS claim.
I raised this with operational stakeholders - this is their response -
I can confirm that there hasn’t been any change in guidance in relation to Income Support carers. There is no requirement on IS carers to look for work as a condition of their entitlement to IS. There is certainly no Work-Related Activity (WRA) requirement placed on this group of claimants. Only those people claiming IS solely on the grounds of being a lone parent (LP) who have a youngest child aged three or four may be required to undertake mandatory WRA, but even then that is taking into account the LPs individual circumstances and if WRA is appropriate for them.
It might be helpful if I provide a little bit of background to the purpose of a work focused interview (WFI) for people who receive Income Support and Carers Allowance, or who have caring responsibilities, is to provide information about the support available from DWP via Jobcentres. For those who are interested in combining their caring responsibilities with work or in preparing for a time when their caring responsibilities may end, the WFI provides an opportunity to identify and agree exactly what support Jobcentre Plus can provide.
The support available includes:
- regular voluntary meetings with a personal adviser to plan the appropriate steps to take to find or prepare for work
- work preparation, including help with CV writing or interview skills
- access to Jobcentre Plus approved training courses or Work Trials
- help with expenses such as travel and replacement care costs when taking part in work preparation activities
- help to calculate whether carers would be better off in work when considering a job, and
- advice on in-work benefits and adviser support during the early weeks in work.
I hope this clarifies the position regarding WFA and Carers.
Is there any risk that IS will say that he has notional income from the (surrendered) Carers Allowance?