ESA and sanctions

Claimant was in the WRAG and failed to attend some appointments towards the end of last year. She got the £28.75 for some time and then all her ESA stopped in around October 14 as she failed to attend a compliance interview. She lived on CTC and CB until she came to see me at the beginning of Feb 2015. Tenant is a bit chaotic and doesn’t have any letters etc.

The details of her previous claim were a bit unclear so we put a new ESA claim in. This has been paid but at the £28.75 a week rate. I called DWP and they said it hasn’t been linked to previous claim and has been treated as a new claim so I don’t understand why the sanction is still applied and why she is in the WRAG.

I also want to get her into the Support Group - she has severe mental health problems - but I’m not sure now whether its a supersession of her previous claim (even though there has been a 4 month gap since last claim which ended in Oct 14) or wait until she has a new medical for this new claim and if she is not put in Support Group ask for MR of that decision.

I haven’t dealt with many ESA sanctions that have gone on for this long - normally just do a good cause for failing to attend and get back on full rate.

Any ideas?

Presumably she is still subject to a sanction (I haven’t checked but from memory sanctions don’t ‘die’ if a claim is terminated) hence the low rate of her current ESA.

I think I’d be requesting a late MR of the original/subsequent sanction decisions in tandem with a supersession request (again late) to get her placed in the SG from the date of the original sanction decision (if that makes any sense?)

Thanks 1964, that’s really helpful. I know with JSA sanctions continue even after a break in claim but I can’t find anything that says either way what the situation is with ESA. I suspect it is the same hence why she’s only getting WRAG. I will do as you suggest regarding a late MR and supersession.

Many thanks

ESA sanctions run until the claimant has completed the (work-related)activity which triggered the sanction.

CPAG page 1102 -1104 refers.
The sanction period runs until you agree to take part in an interview/WRA, or actually complete it, plus/or a fixed sanction period of 1-4 weeks

Yes but I thought this was a new claim. Her previous claim was sanctioned back in Sept 2014 and she got the £28.75 pw but then payment stopped altogether so I thought her claim had ended.  Normally wouldn’t you just keep getting the £28.75 indefinitely if you didn’t participate in the WRA until you did? In what circs would payment stop entirely other than your claim having ended?

If when she came to see me initially she was still getting £28.75 I would have advised her to attend the WRA to get payment back in full and then tried to get her in the Support Group.  But when she came to me she hadn’t received any payment for 4 months and she told me she had been advised her claim was close. She didn’t have any letters and I kept getting different info from the JCP so decided putting in a new claim was best option in the first instance to get claim up and running.

I’m finding it is getting harder to work out what has happened before with claims and it is getting more and more important to be able to get these details correct. The new rules for ESA from 30/3/15 are going to make this even harder. Knowing exactly what condition was on previous sick notes and when exactly previous decisions were made….  but that’s another discussion

Thanks for comments it’s very helpful to have others input

Hi Jo,

It just occurred to me, is your client claiming ‘new style ESA’? If so, ESA 2013 Reg 51 suggests that sanctions could total anything up to 1095 days (3 years) if added together.

ESA 2013 Regs say that if sanction/reduction is applied and person’s ESA claim ends then restarts again, sanction can be carried over - Reg 55. see also ADM at V7190 for new style ESA sanctions and claims previously terminated.

If she failed to attend the compliance interview it is likely that her ESA claim was either suspended or terminated - do you know which? If suspended then unsuspended, could sanction have been effectively frozen in time and reactivated when claim put back in payment so even if it was only a relatively short sanction it could still be in effect?? I don’t know.

As you say, getting rather complex and only going to get more so after 30/3.

Good luck with it.

Don’t forget that CPAG are still looking for potential JR cases where people have recentlybeen sanctioned and that Work Related Activity might not be reasonable considering the findings in the Work Capability Assessment report.

Thanks for responses.

The JCP have rung her back and told her until she re-engages with WRA the sanction remains. I think it is as you say Billy, the sanction was frozen when her last claim was suspended and now the claim is unsuspended the sanction is back in place.

She tells me she has rung WP who say the course she was on has finished and she is no longer on their books….

I have put in a late MR of the sanction decision - she tells me she was in hospital having taken an overdose on the day of one session but they said that did not constitute good cause! I have also put in a late supersession to try and get her in Support Group.

Dan - yes the CPAG JR thing occurred to me but she probably wouldn’t engage with that. Reminds me to ask for a copy of the WCA though

Thanks

Jo Woodcock - 11 March 2015 04:59 PM

She tells me she has rung WP who say the course she was on has finished and she is no longer on their books….

 

Thanks

That doesn’t ring true unless she has completed the 104 weeks of Work Programme; WRA isn’t one course after another, it’s one solid block of activity.

Now if the 104 weeks has expired and JCP are compelling her to re-engage that throws up a whole different and potentially controversial can of worms. How can she re-engage when there’s nothing to re-engage with?

That is very firmly JR territory and I would strongly suggest a call to CPAG.

Not sure this is true - WP = 104 weeks butt here are courses/schemes out there for ‘Work Programme Completers’ - I’m not aware of anything to say WRA = 104 weeks.

On the OP point - The matter might be an administrative one - where there is no engagement and no Exit Report form filled in to complete and finalise the WP then the DWP leave the marker on from past experience.

Why doesn’t this have an automatic 104week limit on it?

Where WPP can’t/won’t/don’t return the Exit Report then the matter is one with the DWP.

The only date I have noted is the termination following compliance failure Oct 14. If there’s another date I apologise in advance.

For the WP-WRA to not have effect the referral would have to be pre- 19th March 2013 as I write.

If the referral was after March 2013 then engagement is required.

IME the DWP wash their hands of it and leave the matter with the WPP to issue the appropriate requisite prescribed forms.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/394684/wp-pg-chapter-10.pdf

Have you tried the NW Complaints team?

To further confuse the matter, I thought I’d throw something out there.

I recently helped somebody with an ESA termination. She doesn’t speak English, really - this is relevant.

The Jobcentre had attempted to schedule appointments on various occasions, which had been missed or rescheduled by family members. In the end, her claim was terminated. A call to the local Jobcentre and the BDC discovered that her claim had been terminated because letters and calls were unanswered, which implied to Jobcentreplus that she may have moved/died or similar.

This was not a sanction case, thankfully, but if she were sanctioned, the claim would have ended anyway for the reason above. A new claim was submitted with the request to link them together.