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Top Incapacity related benefits topic #4886

Subject: "Continence and artificial stoma" First topic | Last topic
Ruth_T
                              

Volunteer adviser, Corby Welfare Rights Advice Bureau
Member since
03rd May 2005

Continence and artificial stoma
Thu 18-Feb-10 06:53 PM

The ESA continence descriptors are driving me to distraction.

Our client underwent bowel surgery and has a colostomy. He says that he is perfectly capable of fixing, removing and emptying the bag himself and has no problem doing so. However, because of the nature of his surgery, the bag doesn't fit well and it leaks at the join. For this
reason he rarely goes out and refuses to use public transport.

Does anyone think that there any way in which ESA descriptor 10(c)(ii) can be read so that 'without causing leakage of contents' includes leakage sometime after affixation?

  

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Replies to this topic
RE: Continence and artificial stoma, clairehodgson, 18th Feb 2010, #1
RE: Continence and artificial stoma, Ruth_T, 18th Feb 2010, #2
      RE: Continence and artificial stoma, clairehodgson, 18th Feb 2010, #3
           RE: Continence and artificial stoma, ariadne2, 18th Feb 2010, #4

clairehodgson
                              

solicitor, CMH Solicitors, Durham
Member since
09th Apr 2009

RE: Continence and artificial stoma
Thu 18-Feb-10 07:45 PM

"Where the claimant's artificial stoma relates solely to the evacuation of the bowel, at least once a week, loses control of bladder so that the claimant cannot control the full voiding of the bladder"

it doesn't make sense to me.

the stoma relates to the bowel, but the person loses control of the bladder? the bladder being a completely different part of the body to the bowel ...

given that words are taken to have their natural and ordinary meaning, i think there's some bad drafting here.

would make more sense if it said, the stoma pouch leaked, since that would at least be relevant to having a bowel stoma

so no, i don't think you can (being very legalistic indeed, but those are the words used)

  

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Ruth_T
                              

Volunteer adviser, Corby Welfare Rights Advice Bureau
Member since
03rd May 2005

RE: Continence and artificial stoma
Thu 18-Feb-10 08:17 PM

Claire:

I think you might be looking at descriptor 10(c)(iii). I'm considering 10(c)(ii).

Ruth.

  

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clairehodgson
                              

solicitor, CMH Solicitors, Durham
Member since
09th Apr 2009

RE: Continence and artificial stoma
Thu 18-Feb-10 09:17 PM

oops...sorry..you're right ... and therefore worth pop

"Is unable to affix remove or empty stoma appliance without causing leakage of contents"

doesn't say anything about WHY the leak happens,

still the the other one suffers from major misdrafting, LOL

  

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ariadne2
                              

Welfare lawyer and social policy collator, Basingstoke CAB
Member since
13th Mar 2007

RE: Continence and artificial stoma
Thu 18-Feb-10 09:34 PM

No, the incontinence descriptors deal with the following different scenarios:
1 - person with natural bowel and bladder who is incontinent of urine;
2 - person with natural bowel and bladder who is incontinent of faeces;
3 - person with urinary collecting device who is incontinent of urine;
4 - person with urinary collecting device who is incontinent of faeces;
5 - person with bowel stoma who is incontinent of urine;
6 - person with bowel stoma who is incontinent of faeces.

  

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