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Forum Home  →  Discussion  →  Universal credit administration  →  Thread

Establishing date of UC claim

Jon (CANY)
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Welfare benefits - Craven CAB, North Yorkshire

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Does anyone have experience of how regulation 10 of the UC claims and payments regs was applied under Assisted Digital Support, or this there published guidance on it? The reg allows for someone to put DWP on notice that they need support to claim. If they are then supported in a certain manner to make the claim, the date of the original notice can be the date of claim, rather than the date the claim is received. There’s a previous related thread here:

https://www.rightsnet.org.uk/Forums/viewthread/12567/

The issues I see include:

- how does someone actually register their intention to claim? DWP seem to have no mechanism to record this

- if ADS was provided by the local authority on their own premises, say, can this meet the reg 10(b) requirement for it to happen at an authorised office, as defined in reg 2?

Has anyone tested any of this, or is it easier to just rely on backdating under reg 26?

Elliot Kent
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I don’t have an answer for this. It’s a very good question. Perhaps someone involved in the whole AD/PBS thing might know.

ADM quite optimistically states:

Sanjay contacts his local Jobcentre Plus office on 1 June to say that because of difficulties speaking English he requires assistance with making a claim to UC online. Sanjay is invited into the office where he will receive assistance with making a claim by a member of staff who speaks his language. Sanjay attends on the 10 June and successfully makes his claim. The date of claim to UC is 1 June.

I think in practice what I have been seeing is that the Sanjays of the world are simply being told to go away and sort it out themselves rendering it something of a moot point what the date of claim would be.

 

Jon (CANY)
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Thanks Elliot. Yes, it’s all a bit vague, and normally difficult for an advisor to get involved at the earliest stages. I’m not encouraged when JCP themselves are unsure what the process is meant to be.

Andrew Dutton
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We have a case about this at MR presently; we made a request for a home visit (via email) and there was a delay on DWP’s part before anything was done.

UC have refused to accept the date of the email as the date of claim.

We argue that DWP was on notice the moment they got that email, which was on a form of our devising which specifically refers to date of claim and the C&P Regs.

The situation may not be straightforward, however, as HV was requested, DWP considered the matter and then said they would accept a telephone claim from the claimant’s support worker, but will only accept the claim date as the date at which that call was made, which was quite a bit later as there was a major holiday and everywhere was closed for several days.

I’m not sure how such a situation will be treated under Reg 10 C&P. Seems a shoo-in for Reg 26 though.

Another example of poorly thought-through legislation with inbuilt disadvantage to the vulnerable.

Jon (CANY)
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So, according to this FOI request:

Regulation 10(1)(b) of the Universal Credit, Personal Independence Payment, Jobseeker’s Allowance and Employment and Support Allowance (Claims and Payments) Regulations 2013 applies where assistance is provided by the Secretary of State or a person providing services on behalf of the Secretary of State. The provision of services generally requires a contractual relationship. Assisted Digital support provided under Universal Support was not provided contractually but rather via a Grant Funding agreement. Regulation 10(1)(b) therefore did not apply to those accessing the Universal Support Assisted Digital support.

Both the previous Universal Support model and the new Citizen’s Advice support model run alongside our national Jobcentre Plus offer, and provide additional and alternative support for claimants who need help making their first claim. Until a claim is completed and submitted, a claimant cannot access support such as that provided by work coaches and advances of benefit so the critical factor has always been to provide support to make and complete a claim quickly rather than rely on regulation 10(1)(b) to protect a date of claim.

 

EDIT: I’d be grateful if anyone can reconcile the statement I bolded with this, from Sandra McDermott at Glasgow City Council:

... Previously, as the convener mentioned, funding for the local authorities to provide support for universal credit came through an arrangement with the secretary of state, which gave us the converted powers to protect the date of claim.

Was ADS set up differently in Scotland?

 

[ Edited: 11 Jun 2019 at 05:45 pm by Jon (CANY) ]
Jon (CANY)
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Jon (CHDCA) - 11 June 2019 09:39 AM

So, according to this FOI request:

Regulation 10(1)(b) of the Universal Credit, Personal Independence Payment, Jobseeker’s Allowance and Employment and Support Allowance (Claims and Payments) Regulations 2013 applies where assistance is provided by the Secretary of State or a person providing services on behalf of the Secretary of State. The provision of services generally requires a contractual relationship. Assisted Digital support provided under Universal Support was not provided contractually but rather via a Grant Funding agreement. Regulation 10(1)(b) therefore did not apply to those accessing the Universal Support Assisted Digital support.

Both the previous Universal Support model and the new Citizen’s Advice support model run alongside our national Jobcentre Plus offer, and provide additional and alternative support for claimants who need help making their first claim. Until a claim is completed and submitted, a claimant cannot access support such as that provided by work coaches and advances of benefit so the critical factor has always been to provide support to make and complete a claim quickly rather than rely on regulation 10(1)(b) to protect a date of claim.

 

EDIT: I’d be grateful if anyone can reconcile the statement I bolded with this, from Sandra McDermott at Glasgow City Council:

... Previously, as the convener mentioned, funding for the local authorities to provide support for universal credit came through an arrangement with the secretary of state, which gave us the converted powers to protect the date of claim.

Was ADS set up differently in Scotland?

 

Unsurprisingly, the information you requested is not held by this Department.


.. aaand, I now note that the SoS has written to Bob Doris:

Unfortunately, the [sic] has never been a legal basis for the process you describe whereby a third party can “protect the date of claim” for Universal Credit claimants.

.. of course, saying that there was no legal basis for a process isn’t quite the same thing as saying that process never happened…

much later edit for future reference: much more discussion on this topic here: https://www.rightsnet.org.uk/forums/viewreply/69833/

[ Edited: 30 Jul 2019 at 11:28 pm by Jon (CANY) ]