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BC Welfare Rights
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2nd email saying….

“Can you put a hold on the mixed aged couple date, I’m waiting for some information from the UC project. As soon as I hear anything I’ll let you know.”

shawn mach
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We’ve removed the DWP partnership newsletter word document linked to by BC above following contact from the DWP who advise that it does contain some inaccuracies.

Cheers -Shawn

Jon Blackwell
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shawn - 28 November 2018 05:09 PM

We’ve removed the DWP partnership newsletter word document linked to by BC above following contact from the DWP who advise that it does contain some inaccuracies.

Cheers -Shawn

Did they say which parts were inaccurate?

 

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Jon Blackwell - 29 November 2018 02:48 PM

Did they say which parts were inaccurate?

Ahem, no I’m afraid not ..... so I guess we’re still left in the unsatisfactory position that either the Feb date is wrong, or it’s right but they didn’t want it to be public knowledge yet!

I think we’re planning to make some more enquiries (there’s a stakeholder meeting next week) ... plus maybe Paul will turn something up from his contacts at the Pension Service

 

Tina M
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That was our question Jon and certainly we are assuming the same - that it is either wrong or they don’t want us to know yet.  I’ve asked our DWP contact who has asked his managers and they are saying they know nothing about this.  We’re thinking about planning a Pension Credit take up campaign on the just in case it is 1st Feb, as there is no harm in doing this.

Paul_Treloar_AgeUK
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We’ve been told that there’s no date fixed currently for the implementation of changes that would see mixed-age couples having to claim UC.

Daphne
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My contacts via stakeholders have also said no date yet fixed to the best of their knowledge…

Carlo
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Paul_Treloar_AgeUK - 18 October 2018 03:02 PM

Nothing really to add Darren, the advance PC claim can be made up to 4 months in advance and we’ve been told by Pension Service that the transfer should happen automatically from UC to PC.

We’ve heard of people being told they must supply proof that the UC claim has been closed by Pension Service but that shouldn’t happen - if it does, please let me know, as they’ve asked for examples of this type of gatekeeping.

Because the PC claim should kick off automatically from state pension age and the advance PC claim has been lodged, the UC claim will be automatically pro-rated so you shouldn’t even need to close it. Don’t forget to make HB claim as well if relevant.

 

Hi Paul, I don’t know if this is relevant for you but I’m hoping you might have an idea;
Couple been claiming UC (FS) since Jun/Jul 18 - helpfully told by JC to do this. He turned pension age 19/8/18. (wife 61 yrs).
They tried to make a claim for PC in Sept. PS told them it would take 31 days. In October they received a phonecall from PS advising them that they cant have PC as wife claims UC.
I’ve told them to try again as its going to be a while before I can get to see them, but wondered if you had a different viewpoint

Thanks

Paul_Treloar_AgeUK
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Carlo - 05 December 2018 03:34 PM

Hi Paul, I don’t know if this is relevant for you but I’m hoping you might have an idea;
Couple been claiming UC (FS) since Jun/Jul 18 - helpfully told by JC to do this. He turned pension age 19/8/18. (wife 61 yrs).
They tried to make a claim for PC in Sept. PS told them it would take 31 days. In October they received a phonecall from PS advising them that they cant have PC as wife claims UC.
I’ve told them to try again as its going to be a while before I can get to see them, but wondered if you had a different viewpoint

Thanks

Well it’s nonsense isn’t it?

See this thread People not getting through pension credit gateway - call for examples from Daphne where you can pass on details and they have promised to look into what has happened to your clients.

They cannot (or more pertinently should not) be refusing to allow anyone to make a claim. Its as simple as that. Please get in touch with Daphne.

HB Anorak
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The problem they have at the moment though is that they are on UC and there is no legal reason why they shouldn’t be - people in this group have a choice.  Reg 5 of the UC(TP) Regs says you cannot be entitled to SPC if you are also entitled to UC.  Therefore they are going to have to ditch the UC before they can become entitled to SPC.

Reg 13D of the 1987 Claims and Payments Regs allows an advance claim for SPC to be made, but would this situation satisfy it?  There isn’t a clear date on which entitlement will commence: all the claimant can say is “believe me, I have every intention of coming off UC just as soon as I safely bank the next payment”, is that sufficiently certain to allow an advance claim?  It is not the same as when a single UC claimant is approaching SPC age, because in those cases UC should stop automatically and the regs allow a seamless SPC claim to be lined up in advance.  But here, I think the claimants are going to have to relinquish their UC award (with careful timing) and then the older member of the couple can immediately claim SPC.  SPC should also be backdated to the first day after the final UC AP, even though the claim will be delayed a few days until the UC payment has been received.

In summary, they should do this:

- watch out for next UC payment to hit bank account
- immediately tell DWP “That’s me done with benefits, if it’s all the same to you I would just as soon not be a claimant any more.  I’m signing off.  Thanks and bye-bye”
- immediately after that, claim SPC and specify that they are claiming in respect of the period beginning the day after the last UC AP
- at the same time claim HB and/or tax credits as appropriate

PS, I say “they” but technically they are both on UC as joint claimants, whereas only the older member of the couple will be the SPC claimant

[ Edited: 6 Dec 2018 at 08:47 am by HB Anorak ]
Paul_Treloar_AgeUK
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HB Anorak - 06 December 2018 08:44 AM

The problem they have at the moment though is that they are on UC and there is no legal reason why they shouldn’t be - people in this group have a choice.  Reg 5 of the UC(TP) Regs says you cannot be entitled to SPC if you are also entitled to UC.  Therefore they are going to have to ditch the UC before they can become entitled to SPC.

Reg 13D of the 1987 Claims and Payments Regs allows an advance claim for SPC to be made, but would this situation satisfy it?  There isn’t a clear date on which entitlement will commence: all the claimant can say is “believe me, I have every intention of coming off UC just as soon as I safely bank the next payment”, is that sufficiently certain to allow an advance claim?  It is not the same as when a single UC claimant is approaching SPC age, because in those cases UC should stop automatically and the regs allow a seamless SPC claim to be lined up in advance.  But here, I think the claimants are going to have to relinquish their UC award (with careful timing) and then the older member of the couple can immediately claim SPC.  SPC should also be backdated to the first day after the final UC AP, even though the claim will be delayed a few days until the UC payment has been received.

In summary, they should do this:

- watch out for next UC payment to hit bank account
- immediately tell DWP “That’s me done with benefits, if it’s all the same to you I would just as soon not be a claimant any more.  I’m signing off.  Thanks and bye-bye”
- immediately after that, claim SPC and specify that they are claiming in respect of the period beginning the day after the last UC AP
- at the same time claim HB and/or tax credits as appropriate

PS, I say “they” but technically they are both on UC as joint claimants, whereas only the older member of the couple will be the SPC claimant

I don’t disagree with the main trhust of what you’re saying Peter, but it whilstt there may be issues around entitlement to think about, the fact of the matter is that they have a right to claim Pension Credit, they shouldn’t be told that they can’t claim.

I could claim Pension Credit if I wanted to, even though I’m not at retirement age. Instead of simply turning people away, they should be facilitating a smooth transition to assit these people.

Tina M
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there is an article in the ‘i’ paper which is suggesting that now the full service roll-out is complete they will be introducing legislation to prevent mixed age couples from claiming UC - not sure if they are just speculating or know something we don’t. 

https://inews.co.uk/news/universal-credit-dwp-benefits-pensioners-younger-partners-mixed-age-couples/?fbclid=IwAR2WzyuaELAyX6UeIKGs17GLlVxxl3IAWTC1YskcP1V1tURok6FsBrMqDsM

HB Anorak
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Looks as if the i might have picked up on this thread, or otherwise become aware of the now hastily withdrawn stakeholder letter.  The reporter or a researcher contacted Age UK and since one of the regular contributors to this forum, and indeed this thread, works for Age UK I assume he would know if there is anything more definite.

I wouldn’t have thought the government needs any more unnecessary self-inflicted grief right now. On Amber Rudd’s “to do” list this is probably sitting just above “marry Jacob Rees Mogg”

Andrew Dutton
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An inability to organise a bacchanal in a brewery comes to mind….

TP45
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If you’re over Pension Credit qualifying age, you can claim Universal Credit or Pension Credit as a couple if you have a partner who’s under Pension Credit qualifying age. From 1 February 2019 most couples will not be able to claim Pension Credit until both partners have reached Pension Credit qualifying age.

http://www.gov.uk/government/publications/universal-credit-and-your-family-quick-guide/universal-credit-further-information-for-families