Here's a strange one....client summoned to his first ever PCA examination. Before the exam commences he asks the EMP for proof of identity and is shown what is probably the Dr's Atos Origin photo ID. Client then asks for further ID, e.g. medical certificate etc. At this point Dr leaves room, makes a call, returns and says examination is over.

Client then deemed to have failed to submit to medical.

I argued at Tribunal that he had not 'failed to submit' as the medical was cancelled without the client having an opportunity to submit himself.

Appeal failed - chair stated that whilst it was reasonable to ask for ID, the client's action in asking for additional papers questioned the veracity of the EMP. The chair found that the effect of his conduct made it impossible for the EMP to continue the examination.

Whilst the client's motivation in asking for additional ID beyond the ID card escapes me, I'm not sure that it is entirely reasonable for a medical to be cancelled solely on that basis.

Any thoughts?

Ah! That most Olympian of sports. Jumping to conclusions. Asking to see the doctor’s credentials is not failure to submit to a medical. The doctor should have politely refused to the request and explained to your client the requirement to submit and the consequences of a failure to do so. Only then could it reasonably be said that there was either compliance or failure. From your info’ the decision seems very unsound to me.

On the lighter side however. Some clients can be their own worst enemies. We have all had them. The budding Perry Mason’s: the literal minded pedants, at war with all officialdom, etc.

Many years ago, I came across a piece of social policy research which quoted the true story of an appellant, who after losing his tribunal, attempted to place the chairman under citizen’s arrest on the ground of attempting to pervert the course of justice. I kid you not. What a hoot

Indeed. I knew things weren't going to go well when the chair asked the client what he thought the letters DR on the ID card meant and the client answered that for all he knew they might have been the chap's initials. Ho hum.

Still, I'm not sure being obtuse should disbar you from passing the PCA.

Will ask for reasons.

Thanks.

Well it keeps us all in work doesn't it, I mean if it wern't for clients like this all us welfs would have nothing to do

Have you had the written statement of reasons from the chair? It must be worth a bash at the commissioners. I agree with the earlier post that regardless of his behaviour it is hard to say that asking for further ID was failing to submit and if it was, surely this chap deserved a warning about the consequesnces before the Dr himself terminated the examination.

More than being obtuse not being a disbar to passing the PCA I think it should be on the list of MH descriptors, after all who would want to employ him...oh hang on, he would be perfect material for a decision maker a the DWP!

Coming from CAB-land I of course take a scrupulously non-judgemental approach to my clients' behaviour!

Will be asking for reasons.

I used to be a DWP Decision maker-i was very fair.
As a DM i would have just sent it back up to Medical Services and warned them the the EMO should have evidence of GP qualification handy. The EMO should have asked him if he wanted to proceed with medical examination. On the few examination terminated cases ive had i just got the reasons from the clt and then sent it back to Medical Services to use a different EMO and warned the clt verbally to attend and go through with exam.

Yep - I used to be an Adjudication Officer once and was equally pragmatic.

I suppose to be fair we only get to see the silly stuff sometimes....its not as if there's an endemic problem with decision makers being lodged so far up their own fundaments that the light of day does not intrude....or is there?!?

Totally out of order - for all the EMP knew the client may have had previously undiagnosed underlying mental health problems, evidenced in part by the behaviour described - if the EMP in question had been a GP at one time, one wonders what his bed-side manner would have been like .........