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Top Pension Credit topic #698

Subject: "deprivation of capital" First topic | Last topic
Sayo
                              

Welfare Benefits Case-Worker, Maidstone Citizens Advice, Kent
Member since
02nd Nov 2004

deprivation of capital
Mon 26-Jun-06 03:15 PM

client aged 88, approximately 2 1/2 years ago she received £100.000.00 inheritance after her husband passed away and gave this to family members to avoid inheritance tax. now wishes to claim pension credit but we are concerned that this capital will be discovered and client could end up with an overpayment of benefit and accused of fraud if she does not declare it when she applies ?

question is when a person submits claim for pension credit how far do they request bank statements back to and what are implications of making claim for pension credit without declaring inheritance ?

thanx all for any replies...

  

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Replies to this topic
RE: deprivation of capital, Robbo, 26th Jun 2006, #1
RE: deprivation of capital, Sayo, 27th Jun 2006, #2
      RE: deprivation of capital, Tony Bowman, 27th Jun 2006, #3
           RE: deprivation of capital, SLloyd, 27th Jun 2006, #4
                RE: deprivation of capital, Sayo, 03rd Jul 2006, #5
                     RE: deprivation of capital, Tony Bowman, 04th Jul 2006, #6
                          RE: deprivation of capital, nevip, 04th Jul 2006, #7
                               RE: deprivation of capital, Sayo, 05th Jul 2006, #8

Robbo
                              

Welfare Rights Officer, Stockport Advice
Member since
22nd Jan 2004

RE: deprivation of capital
Mon 26-Jun-06 03:47 PM

Don't know about Pension Credit, but the current IS claim asks for bank statements 'relevant to the time you complete this claim form' amd 'If you currently have savings worth less than £5500 did you have savings of more than this amount during the last 6 months?'.

Bearing in mind PC would go back 12 months automatically, I think she'd be OK if her capital had not been in account in the 18 months prior to claim.

Also, of course, she hasn't deprived herself of capital in order to claim PC, because on the facts of the case she hasn't made a claim for all this time since.

Does that help?

  

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Sayo
                              

Welfare Benefits Case-Worker, Maidstone Citizens Advice, Kent
Member since
02nd Nov 2004

RE: deprivation of capital
Tue 27-Jun-06 10:50 AM

thanx for that robbo, nice 1 geezer and have good week !

  

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Tony Bowman
                              

Welfare Rights Advisor, Reading Community Welfare Rights Unit
Member since
25th Nov 2004

RE: deprivation of capital
Tue 27-Jun-06 12:38 PM

The length of time between the deprivation and the claim does not always mean that the deprivation was not done with intent to secure benefits, although it is, of course, a significant factor. A relevant question would be, at the time of the deprivation, did the client know that she would be eligible to claim SPC in 2.5 years time?

The clear fact in the client's favour is that the deprivation was not done with the 'significant operative purpose' of claiming pension credit; it was done with the intention of avoiding inheritance tax.

The key question now is, does the avoidance of tax in this way have any negative implications with HMRC? I don't know, I think I would recommend the client seek advice from a specialist tax adviser before the possibility of having to answer a deprivation allegation emerges - for either the pension service or HMRC.

Also, there is another potential problems that your client should consider; £100,000 is a lot of money to 'give away'. Playing devil's advocate, how would she respond to an actual capital decision...? That is, the money (at least soome of it) is still hers, just not in her name.

This may not be an issue immediately because, as the previous contributor says, the evidence of the fact may not be immediately obvious to Pension Service as it was so long ago. However, these are the kinds of things that will come back to haunt client's later - especially if they are on HB/CTB as, in my experience, LA investigators tend to be more proactive in looking for work.

I know my response seems very negative, but it's client's like these that we see a few years later asking for advice about interviews under caution...

Tony

  

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SLloyd
                              

Welfare Rights Adviser/Trainee Solicitor, Thorpes Solicitors, Hereford
Member since
03rd Feb 2005

RE: deprivation of capital
Tue 27-Jun-06 12:57 PM

In respect of the inheretance tax, there is nothing wrong per se with making what are known as lifetime gifts but the gifts remain potentially liable for IHT for up to 7 years (I think)if she dies within that period. This is of course depedant on whether she has any of the nil rate allowance (£275,000 the last time I looked) left and the use of an annual £3000 exemtion for gifts. Of course I don't do probate so this info comes with a health warning!

  

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Sayo
                              

Welfare Benefits Case-Worker, Maidstone Citizens Advice, Kent
Member since
02nd Nov 2004

RE: deprivation of capital
Mon 03-Jul-06 03:13 PM

phew !!! wot a scorcher cor blimey guv'nor ...

thanx for the replies and will explore the points raised further.

have good week if poss and will try to be of assistance someday myself.

  

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Tony Bowman
                              

Welfare Rights Advisor, Reading Community Welfare Rights Unit
Member since
25th Nov 2004

RE: deprivation of capital
Tue 04-Jul-06 09:33 AM

I've just had another idea.

Pension Credit came in on 6 October 2003 so if the deprivation was before then, it could never have been with the intention of securing entitlement to pension credit - as the benefit didn't exist then.

I'm pretty sure that there is a CD to this effect (not sure which benefit), although I'm afraid I have no idea what the reference is - maybe someone else will know.

It might also depend on whether the deprivation rules for PC are the same as the 'other benefit'.

  

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nevip
                              

welfare rights adviser, sefton metropolitan borough council, liverpool.
Member since
22nd Jan 2004

RE: deprivation of capital
Tue 04-Jul-06 10:11 AM

Its R(IS) 14/93

  

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Sayo
                              

Welfare Benefits Case-Worker, Maidstone Citizens Advice, Kent
Member since
02nd Nov 2004

RE: deprivation of capital
Wed 05-Jul-06 10:52 AM

cheers tony and nevip, yet more food for thought and greatly appreciated...



  

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Top Pension Credit topic #698First topic | Last topic