Discussion archive

Top Disability related benefits topic #7146

Subject: "DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3" First topic | Last topic
derek_S
                              

Welfare benefit Adviser, Northern Counties Housing Association - South York
Member since
23rd Jan 2004

DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Thu 24-Sep-09 09:15 AM

Have been asked for an opinion on this one. Being asked if an Autistic Child age 3 (who has just received DLA HRC) can qualify - virtually automatically - for HRM.

wording on you gov site is:

(can claim mobility from) age three, if your child is severely mentally impaired with severe behavioural problems and qualifies for the highest rate of care component.

But I have also seen that the HRM for mental health is limited by only applying in cases where:

a state of arrested development or incomplete physical development of the brain exists.

My question is can, in practice, a child of 3 have "arrested or incomplete development" when to my (entirely non medical) mind normal development continues well past 3 years of age.

  

Top      

Replies to this topic
RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, clairehodgson, 24th Sep 2009, #1
RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, sovietleader, 24th Sep 2009, #2
RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, clairehodgson, 24th Sep 2009, #3
      RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, derek_S, 29th Sep 2009, #4
      RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, sovietleader, 29th Sep 2009, #5
           RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, clairehodgson, 29th Sep 2009, #6
                RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, Dan_manville, 01st Oct 2009, #7
                     RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, Poll T, 07th Oct 2009, #8
                          RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, derek_S, 09th Oct 2009, #9
                               RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, ariadne2, 09th Oct 2009, #10
                               RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3, Poll T, 15th Oct 2009, #11

clairehodgson
                              

solicitor, CMH Solicitors, Durham
Member since
09th Apr 2009

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Thu 24-Sep-09 10:28 AM

of course a child of 3 can have arrested or incomplete development; if the child is, for a reason, not meeting the "normal" developmental milestones of speech, mobility, etc etc, then s/he isn't developing fully. whether "of the brain" adds anything - i anticipate that it would not, in most cases, be possible to tell whether the brain was fully developed in its internal workings, even if on scan it looked as though it was all there...

  

Top      

sovietleader
                              

Welfare Rights Advisor, Wirral Welfare Rights Unit
Member since
07th Sep 2009

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Thu 24-Sep-09 10:41 AM

I agree with Claire on the central issue. However, the problem usually lies in satisfying the other parts of regulation 12(5) and 12(6) of the Social Security (Disability Living Allowance) Regs. It is far from automatic that an autistic child will satisfy, in particular, all the criteria at reg 12(6). It will always depend on the individual child

  

Top      

clairehodgson
                              

solicitor, CMH Solicitors, Durham
Member since
09th Apr 2009

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Thu 24-Sep-09 07:40 PM

at that age, it's really a question of how much more assistance is needed than the ordinary 3 year old would need - and bearing in mind that a 3 year old is always going to be accompanied anyway, i would have thought you'd struggle. may be easier as child gets older and would otherwise have been expected to be more independent.

  

Top      

derek_S
                              

Welfare benefit Adviser, Northern Counties Housing Association - South York
Member since
23rd Jan 2004

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Tue 29-Sep-09 08:12 AM

Thank you for your replies they were most helpful.

  

Top      

sovietleader
                              

Welfare Rights Advisor, Wirral Welfare Rights Unit
Member since
07th Sep 2009

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Tue 29-Sep-09 02:29 PM

I am not sure I agree with Claire's later posting, as the criteria at regulation 12(6) don't require a comparison with 3 year olds without extra needs, unlike the criteria for the care component or lower rate mobility component.

  

Top      

clairehodgson
                              

solicitor, CMH Solicitors, Durham
Member since
09th Apr 2009

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Tue 29-Sep-09 08:10 PM

possibly not, but it will be part of the equation ...

  

Top      

Dan_manville
                              

Caseworker, Birmingham Tribunal Unit
Member since
08th Jun 2004

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Thu 01-Oct-09 07:00 AM

There is some benchmarking guidance as to developmental mileposts in the disability handbook that will be of use...

  

Top      

Poll T
                              

Welfare Rights Officer, Nottinghamshire County Council
Member since
05th Mar 2007

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Wed 07-Oct-09 10:30 AM

I've had a lot of SMI cases, most have been turned down by the DBC, regardless of what information I send in, but I haven't lost one yet at tribunal. I take each category in turn - SMI, Disruptive behaviour, social interaction and restraint.
Autism is widely accepted as an SMI but you need to look at learning and development as well. I usually describe the amount of support a child is getting - if they have a lot of services involved at the age of three (portage, speech and language, inclusion support, ECAP workers aswell as any one to one support at nursery, even physio or occupational therapy) it is a good indication of the level a child is developing at and whether they are or will be behind their classmates when they get to school.
Remember that you could get a quite intelligent child, but if they can't apply that in real life say so. If they have no awareness of danger or common sense that also counts. I would expect a three year old to have a basic understanding that cars are dangerous for example.
You would expect a three year old to be quite sociable and to have moved beyond just playing next to other children. They should also have some awareness of taking turns and following rules as well as being imaginative. All skills that most autistic three year olds lack!
Its helpful to describe the triggers for meltdowns and to make it clear that this isn't just a toddler tantrum. Disruptive behaviour could be running into the road, pulling things off shelves in shops - give lots of examples. If they like to follow rituals or routines when out describe those as well as what will happen if those aren't followed.
Restraint is self explanatory but include any physical intervention to stop the child hurting themselves or others. This can be indoors or outdoors. If they self-harm thats very important
Hope that makes sense!

  

Top      

derek_S
                              

Welfare benefit Adviser, Northern Counties Housing Association - South York
Member since
23rd Jan 2004

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Fri 09-Oct-09 10:58 AM

I know I'm being a bit dim but I still do not undrstand one point - not really about SMI but about DLA HRM.

As i understand it SMI (arrested development) can lead to "automatic" HRM when there is HRC.

But in the case that prompted my original question, the child recently got HRC due to the severity and volume of disabilities.. The child is also so disruptive that she has to be restrained from running into the road.

I accept all the comments in above posts as to what demonstrates arrested development etc. but I am puzzled why a child who clearly can physically walk can get HRM. To my simple mind the circumstances of needing restraint exactly qualifies for LRM.

Is HRM an intended consequence or am I looking at this wrongly?



  

Top      

ariadne2
                              

Welfare lawyer and social policy collator, Basingstoke CAB
Member since
13th Mar 2007

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Fri 09-Oct-09 04:53 PM

OK let's disentangle it.

s 73 of the Contributions and benefits Act provides that a person may be entitled to HRM for several reasons not all directly related to being unable physically to walk - being both blind and deaf, for example. The one we are looking at is: "he is severely mentally impaired, and he displays severe behavioural problems" (and he must also be getting the highest rate of care).
The meaning of this provision is then explained in Regulation 12 of the Disability Living Allowance Regs which say that "severe behavioural problems" means "disruptive behaviour which is extreme, and regularly requires another person to intervene and physically restrain him in order to prevent him caused physical injury to himelf or another, or damage to property; and is so unpredictable that he requires another person to be present and watching over him whenever he is awake".
"Severely mentally impaired" means "arrested development or incomplete physical development of the brain, which results in severe impairment of intelligence and social functioning."
Finally you have the case law on it.
Clearly the intervention and restraint is at another level from that indicated by the "guidance or supervision"of LRM, and the indication is that the bahviour must be very different too.
The most notable example of this I came across was a man with severe learning difficulties who lived in a secure residential unit. He was never alone (there was a care worker awake all night covering just 3 residents) and was never allowed out without two large male attendants to be ready to grab him if his behaviour became too much, which it often did.

  

Top      

Poll T
                              

Welfare Rights Officer, Nottinghamshire County Council
Member since
05th Mar 2007

RE: DLA High Rate Mobility for a child of 3
Thu 15-Oct-09 12:21 PM

Its far from being automatic!

  

Top      

Top Disability related benefits topic #7146First topic | Last topic