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New style CESA; ‘terminally ill’ claims not registered or registered as UC claims
It’s widely known that claimants are being told that they must claim UC when they ask to claim new-style CESA - even when they have no entitlement or do not wish to claim UC.
We are now starting to notice problems with CESA in UC full service areas for people who are terminally ill.
Our specialist team helping people with terminal illnesses now has three cases in which claims have been made for CESA only (as the claimant has no UC entitlement for one reason or another) but in each case they have been told that they must claim Universal Credit, or that their CESA claim has not been registered and so has not been processed.
Our advisers have been told that:
• the claims we sent in are ‘not on the system’ and must be re-sent (in spite of the fact that 2 of the claims were sent by recorded delivery and signed for)
• when they are registered in a UC area, ESA cannot access the record, and so, (presumably to make records accessible) new-style CESA claims are being logged as UC claims when they are nothing of the sort.
There appear to be no decisions being made on these claims, notwithstanding that they appear to be valid and wholly unconnected with the UC system.
Is anyone else seeing this phenomenon?
[ Edited: 24 May 2018 at 10:17 am by Daphne ]Apologies for mis-spelling on the title. Fat fingers. I don’t know how to correct it!
Our UC partnership bloke has said this:
‘We have had a few customers just turn up in the jobcentres with ESA claim forms – this process is delaying their claims and could result in late payments, so we need the following process followed to help the customer.
A customer telephones 0800 328 5644.
The contact centre part complete the form over the phone and email it to the customer.
But the important part is that this has been registered then as their date of claim.
If the customer doesn’t have an email address then they will post a form out to the customer – but this still registers the date of claim.
Once the customer has received the form/completed the form, they need to ring the same number and the contact centre will book an appointment in the Jobcentre. These interviews are booked for 1hr 20mins. If a customer needs a home visit this can also be arranged, but only if they can’t attend a site (various reasons)
If you have ESA claim forms in your offices and issue them to the customer – it is so important that you still remind the customer to telephone the 0800 328 5644 number to register the date of claim. Please also remind them to book the appointment once the form is completed. If this isn’t done then the customers date of claim is not registered and they will have to apply for backdating.
The customers that have been sent directly to the Jobcentres with claim forms – we have had to ask them to go on the telephones and register the claim. They have then had to have future appointments booked. This is not good customer service and this isn’t an appointment that we can just slot in to the day as the appointments are 1hr 20 mins.
Also they need to complete the whole form and not just bring in part of the form – which has happened maybe worth mentioning the customer has to have the whole form even if parts aren’t relevant, so we can send the whole lot off or it will come back to the customer with queries.’
But a terminally ill client should not be in the jobcentre for over an hour - the response was not in relation to terminal illness but maybe the problem is not registering the date of claim?
Our UC partnership bloke has said this:
‘We have had a few customers just turn up in the jobcentres with ESA claim forms – this process is delaying their claims and could result in late payments, so we need the following process followed to help the customer.
[...]If you have ESA claim forms in your offices and issue them to the customer – it is so important that you still remind the customer to telephone the 0800 328 5644 number to register the date of claim. Please also remind them to book the appointment once the form is completed. If this isn’t done then the customers date of claim is not registered and they will have to apply for backdating.
Is there any legal basis for this method of deciding the date of claim, as opposed to the date of claim being when the form is received by the ‘approriate office’? If the local JCP isn’t the appropriate office, what is, and why can’t local JCP immediately send claim forms to it? I think the relevant reg is still:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/380/regulation/16/made
Hi Jon
I think the Partnership Manager is missing the point. Let me resolve their processing problems - An ESACB New Style claim is sent with a DS1500 to the appropriate office and processed; I hope that’s it - quick award, no telephone call, no JC appointment, no interview, no assessment. Simple process for terminally ill claimants.
Reg 2 C&P Regs:
“appropriate office” means—
(a)an office of the Department for Work and Pensions or any other place designated by the Secretary of State in relation to any case or class of case as a place to, or at which, any claim, notice, document, evidence or other information may be sent, delivered or received for the purposes of these Regulations and includes a postal address specified by the Secretary of State for that purpose; or
(b)in the case of a person who is authorised or required by these Regulations to use an electronic communication for any purpose, an address to which such communications may be sent in accordance with Schedule 2;
Reg16 C&P Regs - In the case of a written claim for an employment and support allowance, the date on which the claim is made is to be the first date on which
(a)a properly completed claim is received in an appropriate office;
(b)a person first notifies an intention to make a claim, provided that a properly completed claim form is received in an appropriate office within one month, or such longer period as the Secretary of State considers reasonable, of first notification; or
(c)a defective claim is received but is treated as properly made in the first instance in accordance with regulation 15(4),
or the first day in respect of which the claim is made if later than the above.
I cannot see that the DWP has any right to exclude any ‘office of the Department for Work and Pensions’ as an appropriate office or add any other procedural flummery to suit what is in the end their own administrative convenience.
Thoughts?
Apologies for mis-spelling on the title. Fat fingers. I don’t know how to correct it!
I’ve done it for you Andrew ;)
New style CESA claiming has been patchy and all over the place and all ours sent with a DS1500.
UC are now directing us to ESA to make queries about what has happened to the claims but whether they are then aware of them and whether they are paid appears to be a lottery.
In one case claimant had made claim for UC already. We asked for the form through UC and sent with DS1500. Later UC said they weren’t even aware claim was as a person incapable of work and sent a UC50.
I had a case recently where a client was turned away from a jobcentre evidence appointment for new style ESA and told he had to have a fit note to claim, despite being terminally ill and presenting with a DS1500 from his doctors.
I had a case recently where a client was turned away from a jobcentre evidence appointment for new style ESA and told he had to have a fit note to claim, despite being terminally ill and presenting with a DS1500 from his doctors.
I do not like this ‘evidence appointment’ business one tiny bit.
It is not being made clear to anyone that this is needed, and in any case just like the UC claim closures, this is surely an additional procedure AFTER a claim has been completed and should not be allowed to interfere with the claim/date of claim per se.
And, as my colleague John Bott said, people who are terminally ill should not be put through this nonsense in the first place.
I’m reaching for my Complaining Hat again….
I’d settle for “people should not be put through this nonsense in the first place”.
I’d settle for “people should not be put through this nonsense in the first place”.
Speaking of which - yet another case today, client who has worked and paid NI, partner on £40,000 a year, told by DWP staff that CESA does not exist and they ‘must’ claim UC online (they couldn’t do so even if UC were appropriate)
They will soon also be told they ‘must’ claim by phone (they can’t) and ‘must’ attend JC+ interviews or their claim date will be affected.
I agree with Mike - the nonsense is not restricted to any one category of claimant.
I have received a DWP New Style ‘Desk Aid’ from an ESA NS Claims Manager, I am particularly concerned with paragraph 1 - this explains to me why the DS1500 and claims are not being processed (not valid according to ESA) - I will share it word-for-word:
New Style ESA desk aid
1. When a customer indicates that they want to claim ESA C and you establish that they live in a full service UC area their claim is treated differently and is referred to as New Style (NS ESA) or Dual (Receipt of UC & NS ESA). To claim NS ESA, customers have to request a specific UCESA 1 form by calling UC on 0800 328 5644 (choosing option 2 & 6). Once these forms are completed, the customer should be advised to call UC on the same number and follow the same sequence to book a work coach appointment. The customer will be advised to bring their completed form supporting documents to their pre-arranged appointment. This is so that ID can be verified and a customer commitment agreed and more importantly that the claim form can be sent in the proper way to the Centralised site tasked with processing these types of claims (Belfast). UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES should the customer be advised to post this form. THE CLAIM IS NOT VALID IF THESE STEPS ARE NOT TAKEN.
Terminally ill or not - this is their script
‘UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES should the customer be advised to post this form. THE CLAIM IS NOT VALID IF THESE STEPS ARE NOT TAKEN.’
I don’t think this is legally justifiable.
Views?
The nearest I can make this process fit the regs is: this is a telephone claim, not a written claim. They are not using the ESA1 as a claim form, but instead as a “written statement of the person’s circumstances”, without which the claim is indeed not valid - see r13(2) of 2013/380. Thus in post #2 above: “The contact centre part complete the form over the phone and email it to the customer”.
Now in practice they seem to be just sending out blank forms, which puts a different spin on things…
In any event, r35 can then require attendance in person for evidence verification, if the SoS thinks it is reasonably required.
—
EDIT: Just to speak against my own theory that this all looks a bit like telephone claiming ...
DWP obviously refer to the ESA1 as a “claim form”, and it says on it in the declaration: “This is my claim for ESA”.
They also warn people that ‘Nothing further will be done until the claimant makes contact after completing the forms’, whereas if the initial call counted as the claim, then the SoS should be advising the claimant that their claim is defective in cases where the written statement fails to materialise.
[ Edited: 5 Jun 2018 at 04:40 pm by Jon (CANY) ]Also - 13(2) invalidates a claim where a written statement of circumstances has not been provided when required by the SoS; I can’t see that the claimant posting the relevant form can in any way invalidate the claim -? They’re not failing to provide the statement, they’re just doing somthing DWP doesn’t want them to do -?
The desk aid also seems to say that the claim is not valid ‘if these steps are not taken’ - and seems to try to include booking work coach appointments etc, matters which are surely dealt with under ‘evidence and information’ and cannot invalidate a claim.