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Forum Home  →  Discussion  →  Income support, JSA and tax credits  →  Thread

Can someone claim Income Support as a Carer if the person they look after is in reciept of lowest rate care DLA but is waiting for a PIP decision? 

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iut044
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Hi

I have a client who is receiving DLA lowest rate care.  She made an application for PIP because she wanted to be migrated over early.  The application was made in July 2016 but she is still waiting for a decision.  Can the carer claim Income Support as a carer whilst the person being looked after is waiting for a decision to be made on the PIP?  I know that someone who is a carer of someone awaiting a decision on a PIP claim can normally claim Income Support for up to 26 weeks.  However, would it apply in this case when the person being cared for is in receipt of DLA but only the lowest rate of the care component.

It is stated in The Income Support (General) Regulations 1987 Schedule 1B

4a) A person (the carer)

Who is regularly and substantially engaged for another person if

iii) the person being cared for has claimed entitlement to a disability living allowance, armed forces independence payment or personal independence payment but only for the period up to the date of determination of that claim, of the period of 26 weeks from the date of that claim, whichever date is the earlier.

Thanks

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As far as I know to qualify for Carers Allowance, the person you care for needs to be in receipt of at least middle rate DLAC. Without a underlying entitlement to CA they wouldn’t be able to claim IS as a carer.

iut044
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Phil R - 25 August 2016 09:57 AM

As far as I know to qualify for Carers Allowance, the person you care for needs to be in receipt of at least middle rate DLAC. Without a underlying entitlement to CA they wouldn’t be able to claim IS as a carer.

Thanks for your help R.  Someone can normally claim Income Support as a carer for up to 26 weeks if the person they are looking after is awaiting a decision on a PIP application.  However, I am not sure if this rule applies in this case as the person being looked after is already in receipt of DLA lowest rate care.

Victor
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I would have thought that YES they can get IS and I would certainly argue this at a tribunal if they were turned down. 

You would need to argue that the sentence can be reconstructed as:

the person being cared for has claimed entitlement to a disability living allowance ... but only for the period up to the date of determination of that claim, of the period of 26 weeks from the date of that claim, whichever date is the earlier.

OR

the person being cared for has claimed entitlement to ... personal independence payment but only for the period up to the date of determination of that claim, of the period of 26 weeks from the date of that claim, whichever date is the earlier.

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Thanks

[ Edited: 25 Aug 2016 at 11:27 am by CDV Adviser ]
iut044
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Victor - 25 August 2016 10:23 AM

I would have thought that YES they can get IS and I would certainly argue this at a tribunal if they were turned down. 

You would need to argue that the sentence can be reconstructed as:

the person being cared for has claimed entitlement to a disability living allowance ... but only for the period up to the date of determination of that claim, of the period of 26 weeks from the date of that claim, whichever date is the earlier.

OR

the person being cared for has claimed entitlement to ... personal independence payment but only for the period up to the date of determination of that claim, of the period of 26 weeks from the date of that claim, whichever date is the earlier.

Thanks for your help Victor, what makes you think that the client can do this when the person being looked in after is already in receipt of Disability Living Allowance?

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iut044 - 25 August 2016 10:07 AM
Phil R - 25 August 2016 09:57 AM

As far as I know to qualify for Carers Allowance, the person you care for needs to be in receipt of at least middle rate DLAC. Without a underlying entitlement to CA they wouldn’t be able to claim IS as a carer.

Thanks for your help R.  Someone can normally claim Income Support as a carer for up to 26 weeks if the person they are looking after is awaiting a decision on a PIP application.  However, I am not sure if this rule applies in this case as the person being looked after is already in receipt of DLA lowest rate care.

Hi sorry for the delay in replying.

Further to this point. In order to claim Carers Allowance online, the person being cared for needs to be in receipt of a qualifying benefit or you cannot proceed with the claim. In order to claim Income Support as a carer, you need to have an underlying entitlement to Carers Allowance. I’m really unclear as to at what point somebody can claim carers allowance. Can they claim it at the same time PIP is claimed?

Any advice much appreciated.

Thanks

Victor
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Phil R - 01 September 2016 11:07 AM

In order to claim Income Support as a carer, you need to have an underlying entitlement to Carers Allowance.

This is not true.  See the legislation quoted in the original post.

Victor
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iut044 - 25 August 2016 11:50 AM

Thanks for your help Victor, what makes you think that the client can do this when the person being looked in after is already in receipt of Disability Living Allowance?

Because the legislation not appear to say you can’t do this.  You may need to argue this at a tribunal though.

past caring
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I think you have two sources of confusion Phil.

1. Whilst the normal route to being able to receive IS as a carer is to be entitled to CA (or have underlying entitlement) and this then requires the disabled person/person being cared for to be in receipt of a qualifying benefit, this is not the only route. The rules also permit a person who is actually caring to claim IS for up to six months whilst waiting for a DLA or PIP claim for the person being cared for to be determined.

2. Again, whilst CA can be automatically be backdated for three months, by the time DLA and PIP claims come to be determined (particularly if an appeal is needed) it is often the case that far longer than three months have passed - the rules allow a CA claim to be backdated to the benefit week in which the the qualifying benefit is awarded so long as the CA claim is made within three months of the decision that awarded that qualifying benefit. For the purposes of this rule, the date of decision for the qualifying benfit includes decisions made on mandatory reconsideration or by the First-tier or Upper Tribunals.

It is also possible to claim CA up to three months in advance - e.g. if the carer currently cannot get CA because their earnings exceed £110 p/w but they know their earnings are going to reduce below that threshold, or if the disabled person currently has underlying entitlement to the qualifying benefit (because of a period in hospital or care home) but is due to have payment reinstated due to discharge.

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Victor - 01 September 2016 11:50 AM
Phil R - 01 September 2016 11:07 AM

In order to claim Income Support as a carer, you need to have an underlying entitlement to Carers Allowance.

This is not true.  See the legislation quoted in the original post.

Thanks Victor.

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past caring - 01 September 2016 11:53 AM

I think you have two sources of confusion Phil.

1. Whilst the normal route to being able to receive IS as a carer is to be entitled to CA (or have underlying entitlement) and this then requires the disabled person/person being cared for to be in receipt of a qualifying benefit, this is not the only route. The rules also permit a person who is actually caring to claim IS for up to six months whilst waiting for a DLA or PIP claim for the person being cared for to be determined.

2. Again, whilst CA can be automatically be backdated for three months, by the time DLA and PIP claims come to be determined (particularly if an appeal is needed) it is often the case that far longer than three months have passed - the rules allow a CA claim to be backdated to the benefit week in which the the qualifying benefit is awarded so long as the CA claim is made within three months of the decision that awarded that qualifying benefit. For the purposes of this rule, the date of decision for the qualifying benfit includes decisions made on mandatory reconsideration or by the First-tier or Upper Tribunals.

It is also possible to claim CA up to three months in advance - e.g. if the carer currently cannot get CA because their earnings exceed £110 p/w but they know their earnings are going to reduce below that threshold, or if the disabled person currently has underlying entitlement to the qualifying benefit (because of a period in hospital or care home) but is due to have payment reinstated due to discharge.

Thank you very much for the information, that’s a great help.

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Hi
This is not about CA/IS but about IS for a carer during the first 26 weeks of the cared for person’s disability benefit claim.  Take a look at pp.97-98 of the current CPAG.

Note that IS can runon for eight weeks beyond the 26 weeks.  See p.98 of CPAG.

[ Edited: 1 Sep 2016 at 12:08 pm by GWRS adviser ]
Welfare BU
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Hi

I am piggybacking onto this query as I have a similar situation regarding whether someone can claim IS as a carer for 26 weeks whilst the person being cared for waits for a decision or determination on PIP.  My query is about the meaning of ‘determination’. My client was getting IS as a carer for their husband, who was getting PIP SR DL.  He was reassessed for PIP recently and lost it - we are in the process of MRing that decision.  My client’s CA was stopped as soon as the PIP decision was made (her IS stopped 2 months earlier for unknown reasons - I will be MRing that).  She has made a new claim for IS which will run-on for 8 weeks.  For the purposes of the up to 26 weeks run-on can anyone confirm if the period a PIP claim is processed, decided or determined includes the MR and appeals process?  Past Caring seemed to indicate it does.  If so, I assume I will need to request this in writing, but surely I will need to send proof that the MR and appeal have been received by the DWP?

[ Edited: 22 Sep 2016 at 06:37 pm by Welfare BU ]
McLeod
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Hi

I was wondering if anyone had challenged this at appeal or had any further advice/suggestions?  My case is the same - severe MH issues but client was only in receipt of DLA low rate mobility.  Son is her carer and completed a review for her DLA to PIP and she has been awarded enhanced daily living but only from the 28th December.  Her son had applied for Income Support and CA - CA will be in payment from the 26th December (fair enough) but Income Support was refused in November and a mandatory reconsideration has resulted in the same outcome.  I thought I had made it clear that I was asking them to consider it under the 26 week prior to decision or award of payment but it does not seem to have taken on board.

The DM states that ‘the award date of the PIP is 28/12/2016 and the period for which the award is payable has not yet began so your mother is not in receipt of PIP at this time so IS cannot be paid to you as her carer until this starts as you do not have a condition of entitlement’. 

Have they just totally missed my point or is it that the confusion exists as she was already in receipt of DLA albeit low rate mobility and not even the care element so that part of the claim is completely new.

I think I would like to take it further but I was wondering if anyone had any recent examples or experiences - it does seem to be all about the interpretation.

Thank you for your help

iut044
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McLeod - 28 December 2016 04:49 PM

Hi

I was wondering if anyone had challenged this at appeal or had any further advice/suggestions?  My case is the same - severe MH issues but client was only in receipt of DLA low rate mobility.  Son is her carer and completed a review for her DLA to PIP and she has been awarded enhanced daily living but only from the 28th December.  Her son had applied for Income Support and CA - CA will be in payment from the 26th December (fair enough) but Income Support was refused in November and a mandatory reconsideration has resulted in the same outcome.  I thought I had made it clear that I was asking them to consider it under the 26 week prior to decision or award of payment but it does not seem to have taken on board.

The DM states that ‘the award date of the PIP is 28/12/2016 and the period for which the award is payable has not yet began so your mother is not in receipt of PIP at this time so IS cannot be paid to you as her carer until this starts as you do not have a condition of entitlement’. 

Have they just totally missed my point or is it that the confusion exists as she was already in receipt of DLA albeit low rate mobility and not even the care element so that part of the claim is completely new.

I think I would like to take it further but I was wondering if anyone had any recent examples or experiences - it does seem to be all about the interpretation.

Thank you for your help

I would complete an SSCS1.  The law is unclear so therefore it is worth disputing.