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Forum Home  →  Discussion  →  Work capability issues and ESA  →  Thread

(Un) intended consequence?

Andrew Dutton
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Welfare rights service - Derbyshire County Council

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Client was on ESA.

Gets found fit for work and goes to JSA.

Becomes ill whilst on JSA and exhausts the time allowed for claimant to be ill on JSA, even under the new rules.

JSA stops.

Is advised by JC+ staff to make a new claim for ESA

ESA refused - no new condition/worsening says DWP.

Claimant goes for 6 weeks (and counting)without money because too ill for JSA but not ill enough for ESA and arguments are ongoing about evidence to show worsening of condition.

For crying out loud!!!

[ Edited: 29 Jul 2015 at 11:36 am by Andrew Dutton ]
benefitsadviser
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Sunderland West Advice Project

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This will be very common from now on unfortunately

1964
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Deputy Manager, Reading Community Welfare Rights Unit

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Indeed it will be. Picked up an example just this morning. Not hurrah.

Paul_Treloar_CPAG
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This is exactly why this is such a wrongheaded policy that bears no understanding whatsoever of the reality of the circumstances and situation for people with lower level health conditions which demonstrably have significant and enduring impacts on their ability to work.

Benny Fitzpatrick
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Absolutely!  However, these people are now “being supported into work” and are no longer a burden on “hardworking people”. So the policy is a success for IDS and co. Consequences for claimants are not considered as I suspect IDS believes people simply disappear into the ether once their benefits stop!

Andrew Dutton
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This gets worse.

The claimant (as per original post) re-claimed in July on DWP advice, was paid an STBA of £37.50 (having gone 6 weeks (and counting) without money!) has now been told that DM cannot determine LCW without a new WCA, has been told her claim is subject to ‘review’ which will be complete by 24/8/15 but she won’t be paid till then (or till WCA???)

I assume that the remodelled reg 30 has been pulled on her again.

So - it appears she has been told to claim JSA meantime and has to see JC+ today. The same JC+ that stopped her JSA as she was too ill..

She has written to her MP. No reply. [edit - in fairness to the MP, acknowledgement rec’d today]

[ Edited: 11 Aug 2015 at 12:38 pm by Andrew Dutton ]
benefitsadviser
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Just had a similar one.

Jobcentre Plus adviser refusing to allow client to sign on and has closed her claim without her consent as she “must claim ESA instead”

She cant

Reg 30 put a stop to that, as no new condition or deterioration since she failed WCA in March.

If she claims ESA then no payment until WCA. Needs to claim JSA in meantime

And of course once the JSA claim is put into place the ESA claim will close, and therefore no WCA and no ESA?

Wonderful

1964
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Just had another one. Don’t know how client lost his WCA appeal (was expecting him to make SG) but he did. Claimed JSA- struggled- was told by JC to get letter from GP confirming whether or not currently able to work. Did so- GP expressed opinion client not capable of work (and will never be capable due to his ongoing condition). JC closes down JSA claim- tell client to reclaim ESA. No deterioration, no new condition…...

Have requested SOR from the failed WCA appeal but (as I have just been trying to explain to incredulous interpreter) short term it’s food parcels and DLA only.

Dan_Manville
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It must be said that CfHaDA are moving pretty quick on assessments where they have enough medical evidence to make a decision. They seem averse to calling people for assessment unless they need to.

Plenty of medical evidence with the ESA50 might make a world of difference…

Grunkle
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What of Uncle Fester’s new jolly jape where by those not in the support group will be encouraged to ‘take up’ any employment that they are capable of - even if its only of a few hours. Can see employers being understanding of someone that can ‘work’ for a few hours a week.

Andrew Dutton
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The speech is vague and as close to meaningless as possible, crammed as ever with dog-whistles and dodgy stats. You would think no-one had ever worked in the UK till he got in to office. And it’s all the fault of that other party…

He claims that the roll-out of UC is ‘well under way’. Oh yeah????

He claims that the Work Programme ’ is I believe, the most successful back to work programme we’ve ever seen.’ Note the ‘I believe’. That is presumably his get-out clause on that claim.

He describes ‘sickness benefits’ as ‘expensive’; I think that here he gives away what his real concern is. he insists it’s about people, but it’s about money.

He is apparently threatening action against those who put the ‘stories’ of fake benefit claimants in to the infamous recent leaflet. His own fantasies are however apparently beyond criticism - he has once again started personally insulting those who question him.

And using that irritating pet phrase ‘the reality is’.

Aaaaarrrrgh!

 

Ros
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Mr Finch
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ros - 24 August 2015 04:46 PM

http://www.rightsnet.org.uk/welfare-rights/news/item/iain-duncan-smith-signals-reform-of-wca-to-focus-on-what-a-claimant-can-do

Sounds oddly familiar:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7175350.stm (the final sentence)

To paraphrase Orwell:

“Things like [redefining a seriously ill or disabled person as fit for work] can indeed be defended, but only by arguments which are too brutal for most people to face, and which do not square with the professed aims of the political parties. Thus political language has to consist largely of euphemism, question-begging and sheer cloudy vagueness.”

Andrew Dutton
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I’ve put in a FOI request for the source of the stats etc that were used in this speech. Just interested y’know….

Paul_Treloar_CPAG
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In the speech, which members of the media were not allowed to attend, Duncan Smith said… (my emphasis)

Iain Duncan Smith criticises employers over disability employment gap

Sp he won’t even face the media when making significant policy announcements now then?

Andrew Dutton
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He was only ‘starting a conversation’, his bag-carriers have said so!!!

Who wants the silly ol’ media listening in on their conversations, asking daft questions and possibly, for once, doing their job???

I suspect the real conversation he wishes to spark is the one in the pub where people tell each other that ‘they’ get a ‘chitty’ from the Jobcentre and they take it to the pub and get free beer all day every day and I’m paying for their benefits and I know of this bloke what’s never worked and there’s nowt wrong with him and etc etc etc etc…..