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HB and RTI
I understand that HMRC will be providing RTI-derived information to LAs for HB purposes this year.
Does anyone know what information is being shared and when this will be happening?
I heard that this was already being trialled in one of the UC pilot areas (since 99% of people with housing costs in those areas are not getting UC yet), and it isn’t quite as “RT” as you might imagine: it does not involve earnings data being fed through to HB systems for instant claim updating which I think is the long-term vision for UC. As I understand it a time-slice data extract from RTI will be used for data matching and if this throws up a mismatch between the data held by the Council and the data held by HMRC the Council will have to look into it, the same way they do already with the existing matching service. I would think the challenge will be to minimise false positives or true but useless positives: if the Council has someone down as not working at all and HMRC have them earning that is clearly a useful thing to find out, but if the results are cluttered with minor discrepancies amounting to a few coppers the Council will be less pleased.
“it does not involve earnings data being fed through to HB systems for instant claim updating”
From what I have been told it will for Northgate customers.
The one caution I would add was that I was not at the Northgate user group yesterday myself so this is just what I have been told in passing from one of my people who was there.
1st September it all kicks off apparently. I will ask for more info and post it.
Thanks HBA and Jeff
If RTI data is really going to drive reassessments directly then that’s a bit worrying. If it’s just more data matching I guess that LAs will already know to treat the “information” with a healthy degree of skepticism.
(PAYE errors have actually increased under RTI : http://www.theguardian.com/money/2014/jun/20/hmrc-gets-tax-wrong-for-55-million-people )
Yes I have had it confirmed from several sources and several LAs.
It’s happening in September, DWP is encouraging automation and Northgate intend to supply it.
Uncertain at this stage how much I am permitted to post about the details and how much of the detail is “sensitive”, will post more once I get that confirmed.
Yes I have had it confirmed from several sources and several LAs.
It’s happening in September, DWP is encouraging automation and Northgate intend to supply it.
Uncertain at this stage how much I am permitted to post about the details and how much of the detail is “sensitive”, will post more once I get that confirmed.
Were you able to find out anything more about this? There’s very little public domain information.
I can imagine that if it’s just (more) data-matching the fraud aspect might make it “sensitive” but if there’s going to be RTI for HB then that’s a major operational change as well.
I would really like to know more about this as well. I am still hearing that it is data matching, and pretty clunky data matching at that.
300,000 overpayments of which 223,000 relate to HB only.
Referrals will be sent to LAs in batches staggered over a number of months. Each batch will be “fully refreshed” before being sent to LAs.
Will include latest payment (wages or pension) information.
Will commence in September 2014.
Large savings and overpayments anticipated.
Software providers commissioned to provide appropriate system updates.
LAs to get funding for project.
Results monitored by SHBE
More Guidance for LAs being developed and will follow in next few weeks.
300,000 overpayments of which 223,000 relate to HB only.
Referrals will be sent to LAs in batches staggered over a number of months. Each batch will be “fully refreshed” before being sent to LAs.
Will include latest payment (wages or pension) information.
Will commence in September 2014.Large savings and overpayments anticipated.
Software providers commissioned to provide appropriate system updates.
LAs to get funding for project.
Results monitored by SHBE
More Guidance for LAs being developed and will follow in next few weeks.
Thanks - is there any more info on when this will be happening? - I’ve seen both “early” and “late” September suggested. Is it being piloted anywhere?
hi - more info about it in HB Bulletin G7/2014 -
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/hb-bulletin-g72014
here’s also rightsnet news story -
Can I ask a related question?
We’ve seen cases where a council (using Northgate, I believe) takes a WTC income figure taken from their current data-matching system, but are apparently unable to identify, e.g.
- that it includes a disability element, and so they should apply a disability premium to the HB claim
- that it includes a childcare element, and so they should be including a childcare disregard
Is it correct that there is really no automated system to transfer this sort of info from HMRC to the council? And if so, might this be remedied in future?
I’d be interested to know the answer to that one too.
I’ve dealt with two clients recently who have had issues as a result of this. One was receiving WTC via the disabled worker route but the LA concerned apparently had no way of verifying that from the info on the data-matching system (so didn’t apply the correct earnings disregard) and the other case involved the childcare element (different LA so it seems to be fairly widespread).
I will check with someone who has access to the CIS system (it’s strictly rationed in the authorities I am in regular contact with), but as it is second hand info forwarded via DWP I wouldn’t be surprised if some richness is lost on the journey to the LA system. Councils can view rates of tax credit in payment at any time on CIS and it differentiates CTC and WTC, but I don’t think from memory that it tells you which elements go to make up the maximum from which the award was calculated.
Likewise the ATLAS system which fires through changes in the rate of DWP benefits and tax credits only provides an amount of money identified as either CTC or WTC - it won’t say that the award was calculated from a maximum rate including the disabled worker element.
Thought I would post an update on this after talking to some LA staff about it this week.
I can confirm what Jeff M said: at least the big two software suppliers (Northgate and Academy) offer an option of full automation - RTI data populates corresponding fields in the HB system and generates decisions without any human intervention. But the Council I spoke to said they are not activating this option until they have seen that the data quality is reliable: for now they are checking it clerically before deciding whether to change anyone’s HB.
Thought I would post an update on this after talking to some LA staff about it this week.
I can confirm what Jeff M said: at least the big two software suppliers (Northgate and Academy) offer an option of full automation - RTI data populates corresponding fields in the HB system and generates decisions without any human intervention. But the Council I spoke to said they are not activating this option until they have seen that the data quality is reliable: for now they are checking it clerically before deciding whether to change anyone’s HB.
Thanks, HBA. I know that the plan is for 4 LAs to run test data for couple of weeks from this Friday then to go live everywhere on 6 October. That sounds rather rushed to me so I think whoever you spoke to is very wise to be checking manually. (It’s a pity that there’s no transparency on how the software suppliers will be repurposing the RTI data into something useable for HB).
Do you know if decision notices will include mention of RTI/PAYE as the source of the information?
There’s a lot more information now that A15/2014 is out ( as per today’s rightsnet news story).
DWP seem very keen to control the media response to this - LAs have been told not to speak to the press without their say so.
From Annex 4
“1. What do I do if I get an enquiry from the press or any other media?
All responses to enquires from the press or other media require a collaborated response between the LA and DWP.
You should contact your press office who will in turn consult with DWP via the LAST team.
Press Office – Should advise DWP of all RTI press or other media enquires (in the first instance) by contacting the LAST team.
No team or individual should release information concerning the RTI Bulk Match initiative to the press or media.”