PIP or AA?

Hi

Any thoughts on this would be great

My colleague has a male client has a client who reached 65 on 1/4/14.

He is single with no family in the UK.

My colleague assisted in making a PIP 1 claim prior to him reaching 65 and he has since received the PIP 2 that it is due back by 24/4/14 and they are just about to send it off.

What would happen if the client also applied for AA after the PIP2 is submitted which he could do now as he has turned 65.

Would receipt of an AA claim close down the PIP claim? 

We are trying to be tactical as the client should qualify for the standard rate of mob and daily living but he is almost destitute and can’t afford to wait 6-12 months for a PIP decision. 

He has been turned down for pension credit on R2R basis so at the moment he has no income (this is being dealt with at the moment) .  He is currently undergoing treatment for cancer.  Thankfully this is not a special rules case. 

We are leaning towards thinking about claiming AA in the hope that we can secure him some income in the coming months rather than in a years time!

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

I don’t think their IT systems would support both claims at once.  Good practice dictates that, if he claimed AA, they contact the claimant for him to opt to withdraw one or the other but I wouldn’t rely on that happening.  Probably, best to withdraw the PIP claim if he’s determined to claim AA.

Nice one!

Not sure that they could ask client to withdraw AA due to IT probs.
Seems he’s eligible to claim both (IT problems are DWPs not the clients)

Think the problems arise when an award is made. From what we know of the shambles that is PIP your reasoning for applying for AA is sound, the brand new (not it’s a year old here) all singing & dance cr*p that is PIP will take the best part of a year.

Once you have a decision on AA its stick or twist with the PIP claim. Although I’m struggling to see how they could close an AA claim correctly made and awarded even if they nil the PIP claim from a date prior to the AA award.

Not a nice one now, head hurts!

“Seems he’s eligible to claim both (IT problems are DWPs not the clients)”.

While he’s legally entitled to make both claims it’s a pointless exercise as he can’t get AA if he gets PIP (s64 of the SSC&C Act).  Although, I suppose there’s nothing really stopping both claims existing at the same time as a way of covering the bases and see if one gets awarded.

I agree-claim both and if AA is awarded client can decide whether to stick or twist.

I’d be tempted to let the PIP claim run its course even if AA is awarded. If he is subsequently awarded PIP at a higher rate than the AA and elects to receive PIP I can’t see why DWP can’t just offset the arrears due against the AA already paid. Or is that a naive assumption? I can imagine a scenario in which they get their knickers in a twist, suspend both, and client plays piggy in the middle between the two offices…

Thank you for the input. 

We have raised the issue with the DWP because we would like to be certain of the possible effect of making the AA claim.  So far they have not been able to give a answer with any degree of certainty! 

With the financial stakes being so high for this particular client we are concerned with the consequences of making a misinformed decision!

tomg - 17 April 2014 04:47 PM

Thank you for the input. 

We have raised the issue with the DWP because we would like to be certain of the possible effect of making the AA claim.  So far they have not been able to give a answer with any degree of certainty! 

With the financial stakes being so high for this particular client we are concerned with the consequences of making a misinformed decision!

Hi Tomg

Did you get any response from the DWP about making an AA claim when a PIP claim has also been made?  I have a client in this situation.  She is 68 and in the DLA to PIP migration process.  Unfortunately she returned her PIP2 form very late and her DLA has stopped in the meantime.  I can’t confirm if the stopping of DLA is appealable.  Her PIP is now at the F2F assessment stage.  However she has now just claimed AA also due to her income reducing.  She has mobility problems so she would be better off sticking with PIP.  Should I advise her to stop her AA claim now?  I’m concerned she won’t be able to swap her AA claim for any PIP award.

Hugos1 - 25 August 2016 06:47 PM

Should I advise her to stop her AA claim now?  I’m concerned she won’t be able to swap her AA claim for any PIP award.

I think you’ve cause for concern and withdrawal of the AA may be wise here.  I can see problems having the AA revised where, as seems likely, it is awarded before the Pip.  There’s a danger any Pip award in those circs would end the day before the AA start date.  The Dept would be likely to resist revising the AA on the basis that the latter was correctly decided at the time, ie there was no Pip award in place when it was decided.  An option would be to protectively appeal the AA, arguing that at the date of decision there wouldn’t be a legal basis to award it (section 64(1A) SSCBA) should Pip have, albeit retrospectively, been awarded already.  Obviously, the Pip decision would need to be known before the tribunal took place.  It’s possible the Dept might use a similar argument to the one above, ie that the tribunal stands in the shoes of the DM on the facts known at the time, but I don’t think that would be right.

Hugos1 - 25 August 2016 06:47 PM

I can’t confirm if the stopping of DLA is appealable.

If Pip is awarded but is less money than DLA or if it isn’t awarded at all, I’d consider appealing that decision arguing there was no legal basis to terminate the DLA under Reg 13 Pip (TP) Regs once, as must be the case here, the transfer claimant was found to have had good reason for submitting the Pip2 late.  Obviously, the risk to any current Pip award by appealing would be part of that consideration.  You’d be asking the tribunal to hold that Reg 13 above didn’t apply at all and, therefore, that the Pip should not start to be paid until 28 days after the next DLA pay day as opposed to being backdated to the date the DLA was terminated.

Edit: Actually, I take the first part of the above back.  It seems the AA would have to be revised because there don’t appear to be grounds to end the Pip in the above circs.  Once a person is exempt from the rule that you cannot apply for Pip if you’re over 65, as DLA to Pip transfer claimants are, then receipt of AA is not in itself grounds for superseding the Pip award.  Instead, section 64 above is the ground for revising or superseding any AA.