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Top Housing Benefit & Council Tax Benefit topic #6168

Subject: "Joint tenancy - liability" First topic | Last topic
Derek
                              

CAB Adviser, Esher CAB
Member since
09th Mar 2004

Joint tenancy - liability
Thu 21-Feb-08 09:50 AM

Client has joint tenancy with partner. They split up & he leaves the property & ceases contributing to the rent. Client claims Housing Benefit. Is told that she will have to get a new tenancy in her sole name as otherwise her ex-partner will be deemed to be contributing.

I'm sure this is wrong, but can someone please confirm it & point me to the relevant regulations.

  

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Replies to this topic
RE: Joint tenancy - liability, AndyRichards, 21st Feb 2008, #1
RE: Joint tenancy - liability, Kevin D, 21st Feb 2008, #2
RE: Joint tenancy - liability, Gareth Morgan, 21st Feb 2008, #3
      RE: Joint tenancy - liability, Anselmo, 21st Feb 2008, #4
           RE: Joint tenancy - liability, AndyRichards, 22nd Feb 2008, #9
RE: Joint tenancy - liability, Kevin D, 21st Feb 2008, #5
RE: Joint tenancy - liability, Derek, 21st Feb 2008, #6
      RE: Joint tenancy - liability, ken, 22nd Feb 2008, #7
           RE: Joint tenancy - liability, Tony Bowman, 22nd Feb 2008, #8
                RE: Joint tenancy - liability, plumduff, 22nd Feb 2008, #10

AndyRichards
                              

Senior Training Officer, Brighton and Hove City Council, Brighton
Member since
26th Jan 2004

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Thu 21-Feb-08 10:13 AM

Does the LA accept that the partner has indeed left? If they do then they know she is solely liable and the amount of the eligible rent is unaffected by this occurence anyway. On what legislative basis do they propose to "deem" her ex-partner to be "contributing"?

I am also pretty sure that the landlord is under no obligation to issue a "new tenancy". Why would they? There's already a tenancy.

So yes, it's a piece of nonsense.

  

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Kevin D
                              

Freelance HB & CTB Consultant/Trainer, Hertfordshire
Member since
20th Jan 2004

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Thu 21-Feb-08 10:40 AM

Possible CDs: CH/3376/2002 & CH/1344/2005.

  

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Gareth Morgan
                              

Managing Director, Ferret Information Systems, Cardiff
Member since
20th Feb 2004

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Thu 21-Feb-08 03:16 PM

I suspect the Q here is; is the ex-partner contractually liable for any rent?

If so....

  

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Anselmo
                              

Income Recovery Advisor, Longhurst Homes - Boston, Lincolnshire
Member since
31st May 2007

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Thu 21-Feb-08 03:37 PM

Hmmm, it's not qute nonsense if you ask me- but it's pretty close.

The ex-partner will indeed remain contractually liable to pay rent, but so will the remaining tenant, and it is how that rent is apportioned for Housing Benefit purposes that is relevant.

I'd agree with Kevin that CH/3376/2002 is a useful case to raise, specifically paragraphs 49 to 58. They basically state that all relevant factors must be considered by the council when deciding how much rent to apportion to the claimant left behind, and that the proportion of that rent that the landlord expects that remaining individual to pay is especially relevant. I assume the landlord expects the tenant to pay the full amount?

Of course, this is a matter of discretion and I fear you might therefore have difficulty in appealing an unfavourable decision (outside of JR etc), but I may be wrong there. Hope so as this sort of decision always seems very harsh to me, a double whammy for someone who's just been abandoned by a partner.

  

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AndyRichards
                              

Senior Training Officer, Brighton and Hove City Council, Brighton
Member since
26th Jan 2004

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Fri 22-Feb-08 12:51 PM

Actually Anselmo's logic is perfect! The LA can apportion the rent as appropriate in the circumstances. If you're going to apportion the rent between one tenant who occupies all of the dwelling and one who occupies none of it, there's only one apportionment that makes any sense.

  

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Kevin D
                              

Freelance HB & CTB Consultant/Trainer, Hertfordshire
Member since
20th Jan 2004

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Thu 21-Feb-08 04:53 PM

Just to add...

If the clmt was my client, I'd simply get the appeal in and quote the CDs. No point in banging your head against an unresponsive wall. A wonderful phrase used in another forum referred to the concept of a "Benefits Refusal Officer".... I think you've found one.

  

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Derek
                              

CAB Adviser, Esher CAB
Member since
09th Mar 2004

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Thu 21-Feb-08 07:47 PM

Many thanks for the prompt and helpful replies. Could someone please direct me to CH 1344 2005. I can't find it on Rightsnet or the other sites.

  

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ken
                              

rightsnet, lasa
Member since
28th Jul 2005

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Fri 22-Feb-08 09:21 AM

Thanks very much to Kevin D, CH/1344/20005 is now available on rightsnet -

http://www.rightsnet.org.uk/pdfs/CH_1344_2005.doc

  

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Tony Bowman
                              

Welfare Rights Advisor, Reading Community Welfare Rights Unit
Member since
25th Nov 2004

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Fri 22-Feb-08 10:19 AM

Was she told this in an 'official' determination or just verbally. If the former I would seek a review quoting the CD's provided and consider a complaint regarding the standard of decision making.

If the latter, I would definitely complain as the regs provide the circumstances by which claims should dealt with and this situation isn't covered - that amounts to maladministration.

  

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plumduff
                              

debt adviser, manchester city council housing department
Member since
14th Nov 2005

RE: Joint tenancy - liability
Fri 22-Feb-08 03:05 PM

How can they tell her to get a new tenancy agreement.. If she has rent arrears, the landlord will be reluctant to d this, as it would mean any arraers would then become former tenant arrears and as such they would be able to take possession action should they want to..

They may only issue a new tenancy agreement if there are no arrears..

What HB should perhaps be asking for is a forwarding address for him...

  

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Top Housing Benefit & Council Tax Benefit topic #6168First topic | Last topic